Folks Do Not Deserve To Be Shamed Because They Abuse Opioids. However, Pain Patients Are Being Accused Of Having Substance Abuse Disorders, Simply Because They Are Taking Opioids, And That’s NOT OKAY.

Posted byKami Ann DavisPosted inUncategorizedTags:, , , ,

I’m not condemning anyone. I have been on both sides of the spectrum so I understand. But, I hope the other side can see how it feels, as a pain patient. However, I AM condemning the label and stigma that surrounds the term ‘drug addict’ ~

If anything, we should be caring and compassionate to the folks who may of abused prescribed medications or any other substance, because they’re in pain also. It is the reason why they are abusing something in the first place. But, no one seems to get that. My issue is that stop labeling someone something that they are not, regardless of what it may be. For one it’s a lie and second it’s not fair to the person who is being misrepresented.

For example, someone who is taking opioids to numb mental and emotional pain shouldn’t be taking opioids in the first place. First of all, they’re taking the wrong kind of medication. Second, the person who is numbing their emotional pain is not addressing the underlying problem.

I hope I’m not coming off as attacking, because in no way shape or form am I mad at anyone who has an addiction or abused opioids. I am looking down on the healthcare professionals and surrounding people who judge others for taking something for pain or other ailments, whether it be opioids, weed, or Kratom. It’s not right to punish pain patients either or deny them, or classify them as having substance abuse disorders and condemn them for abusing their medication when they have not done that. People who abused their medications need to understand how jacked up that is that now people can’t even get pain relief because others can’t take them responsibly. I don’t hold it against the person who has the disorder or addiction because I’m a psych nurse on top of it. I’ve been on the other side slightly. But, I understand addiction and mental trauma, which drives addiction. It is the healthcare professionals and government who are denying people their medications or assuming they’re abusing it because other people do and that’s messed up. Also, people who condemn others for taking even Kratom everyday. If someone is abusing their medications then I can see it needs to be addressed but people who are responsible and have legitimate problems who have never ever abused anything are being classified as having substance abuse problems or an addiction and that’s NOT OKAY 💚

Bottom Line is that the addiction community and pain community have been forced to conjoin sort of so we need to hear each other out. I have a right to feel the way I do without being attacked from anyone. Anyone in the addiction community or anyone who judges others for having to rely on something ..try to put yourself in the other person’s shoes and then maybe you can understand how pain patients are getting the short end of the stick. It’s not about making the other side feel bad. It’s about vindication as a human being not wanting to be misunderstood and categorized or treated like they did something wrong. I don’t believe in swearing especially when writing or in business matters so my apologies for the one little swear word. It is just so unfair what is happening to pain patients that I had a moment of weakness. So, friends I hope that you can look past this. Lol. Love and Hugs to you all ~ Kami Ann🌟🍃

Before Kratom, I was a prisoner and slave to Western Medicine. Now, I no longer have to jump through their hoops or be treated like a criminal in order to get even partial pain relief.

40 thoughts on “Folks Do Not Deserve To Be Shamed Because They Abuse Opioids. However, Pain Patients Are Being Accused Of Having Substance Abuse Disorders, Simply Because They Are Taking Opioids, And That’s NOT OKAY.”

  1. Oh please tell me this isn’t because of some stupid idiot on facebook? I’m sorry for taking so long to comment, I didn’t even see this until two minutes ago. You’re right, I’ve been on both sides of the wall. People who have physical or emotional pain need pain killers. But I’m not convinced that people who take opioids to numb mental pain aren’t taking the right kind of medicine, they may be, or they may not be. First of all, antidepressants and antipsychotics, which I assume you’re hinting at, don’t work for everyone, and sometimes the opioids just work better. Sometimes, only kratom works, as we’ve seen in a lot of stories about people who use kratom to numb both physical and mental pain. The problem with doctors cutting people off is partly, my opinion here, the opioid abuser’s fault, and partly government regulators panicking. Those who abuse opioids do not do so because they have nothing better to do, so they figure they’ll medicate. I don’t know anyone nor have I ever heard of anyone who thinks like this. Those caught in an addiction usually feel only two things. Physical and emotional pain. The withdrawal symptoms manifest as both, and add rls, insomnia, and a lot of other stuff on top of that, so people dealing with it literally cannot think or function past it. My own personal opinion is that a lot of this is not caused by legitimate doctor prescribed pills, but on the street heroine, fentanyl, oxycodone, etc. I am not an expert whatsoever, so I could most definitely be wrong. I’ve had enough of this shit. If you’ll add me to this MAT group of yours, I’ll start knocking off the heads of the people who think they have the authority and ability to judge others. Kratom is not an opioid. Kratom is not a drug. Well, it’s debatable whether it’s classified as a drug or not, but regardless, it is not an opioid. It is not an SNRI, trycyclic antidepressant, SSRI, benzodiazepine, non-benzodiazepine seditive, narcotic, or any other term you want to apply to it. It is an herb that has some opioid effects, SNRI effects, SSRI effects, but it does not do one thing and one thing only. The way medicine is classified in this country I do not believe has room for medicines that do more than one thing but I could be wrong about that too. Kami is trying to advocate for those of us who choose to take kratom. She doesn’t have the time to deal with people who don’t want it, or don’t want to hear about it. She’s also trying to help people who are struggling with opioid addictions, or inadequately treated chronic pain, discover and use kratom. YOu do not have the right to condemn her or anyone else for attempting this. From what she tells me, most of the comments she gets on her group are actively hostile. You’re not supposed to be doing this, go to rehab, is what they sum up to be. How sare anyone say such things. How about we take away your own crutches, your methadone and suboxone, take it away completely, and when you go whining to us, we’ll simply shrug and kick you out. How would that feel?

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    1. There are a lot of variables here. The brain is complex. Different people respond to different things. I am a psych nurse who worked for years in mental institutions and I know how sick some folks are. Someone who has severe schizophrenia is not going to be able to relieve his symptoms with Kratom. Anything that is highly addictive should be used only imo if the person is getting therapy for their psychiatric problems. You don’t treat psychiatric issues with pain killers. Sure ..it numbs the pain but I don’t support that at all bc it’s basically driving someone to act in an unhealthy matter like covering something up. Kratom is ok imo bc it’s less addicting but even with Kratom I believe that if someone is using it to numb their emotional pain that they need to address it in therapy to try and get to the root of it otherwise they’re ignoring the actual problem. Once the real problem is addressed then if you’re stuck with chronic problems then use Kratom to help with depression and anxiety bc it’s scientifically proven that it helps treat anxiety, depression, and PTSD but since when was opioids proven to treat or relieve anxiety and depression? It’s more of a cover up imo. Yes ..to a certain extent Kratom is too but it’s not dangerous like opioids or alcohol being used to cover up depression and anxiety

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    2. I think you may of misunderstood me? I’m not saying that ppl should take opioids for their mental and emotional pain? Lol I’m not sure if that’s what you thought? I’m saying that we should try to show them compassion instead of condemning them bc they’re in pain also but just a different type of pain. They’re taking the wrong thing. Everything is so messed up. Poor pain patients can’t even get medication anymore bc of the ones who abuse it or took them just to achieve a feeling. That’s messed up bc unfortunately now good responsible ppl are being denied and that’s not ok..

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  2. I was trying to figure out what you meant, that clears it up. Yeah it’s completely screwed up. You’re absolutely right, people are being denied pain meds even when it’s obvious that they need them because of people getting high off of them. Honestly, I don’t really understand what being high is, nor do I understand why people seek it out, but that’s just me being naive. You’re also completely right, show them compassion. I bet the people condemning other people aren’t in pain, so they don’t literally feel the suffering that happens all day around them. There are a lot of people who don’t really understand constant pain, regardless of severity, and think you can take a pill to kill it. You can, if the pill is effective. If not, you can guzzle them and they won’t work. I’m not sure how theropy, psychiatric theropy, works. My impression of it is that they talk to you enough to figure out what drugs to prescribe you, and then let the drugs do the working, but I’m not sure if that’s accurate. There’s this gigantic stigma surrounding people who want theropy, only lunatics should get it, is the general attitude, and if you admit you have a mental disorder, throw them in the sanitarium where i odn’t have to look at them or think about them, is the general attitude. Most people also include drug addicts in that general group, lock them all away in rehab so they can get better so I don’t have to waste my time and money on them, which is callous and cruel. Mostly I’m sick of the people on facebook wearing you down with their callousness, I wasn’t ranting at you when I was calling them out. I have a tendency to try to talk to the people you aim the article at, and not you, I’m sorry for not being clear. I desperately want to form our own little advocacy group on either youtube or facebook, I’ll do whatever it takes to do so. If you can help me figure out how to join live sessions, I’ll do so tonight, no matter how long I have to stay up to get it done.

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  3. This is a screwed up situation all around. Now that people are being denied their pain meds, what can be done now? Is there no way to reverse this disastrous turn of events? Once someone thinks someone else a drug abuser or addicted, they generally think that for life, you could spend years trying to change their mind and it’s incredibly difficult. You, being a psychiatric nurse, understand the symptoms of mental disorders much better than your average person would. What you’d see as a red flag requiring treatment, a lot of people would dismiss as ordinary day to day stress, unless it’s obvious, like skitzofrenia or dramatic mood shifts. There’s this built in mechanism in people which makes it incredibly difficult to realize, oh my god, I need theropy. They associate theropy patients with critical psychotic illnesses, or traumatic incidents, they don’t think about seeing a psychiatrist for their own “day to day stress”. Why, I’m not sure. Another problem is the vague line between physical and emotional pain. Physical pain can turn into emotional pain under some circumstances which I only vaguely understand, and vice versa. Drug withdrawal can cause serious pain of both types, and miraculously the drug they’re addicted to or a suitable substitute will clear it up, because it’s basically the bodies “wait, where are my drugs”? response. It’s just built in, there’s no changing it. What we need is for the regulators to figure out a way to determine true addiction from mere dependence, but the scale is scued. If you show any signs of withdrawal or they think you’re trying to get medications in any way they don’t like, they label you an addict and then the blame game begins. You’re one of the most compassionate people I’ve ever met, but it sounds like you have your limits. Are you angry at the people who are judging or the medical system which makes it possible for them to judge? I’m not sure there is one quick easy answer to all of this, and while kratom can help, it’s not the cure all. It can help physical and emotional pain, but it isn’t going to reverse someone’s mental disorder, it may help with the symptoms but you’re right, until they pluck out the thorn, kratom is just another tool to try to escape the symptoms

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  4. I agree. It used to make me so mad and it was awkward when the whole opioid crisis started bc I was taking opioids and it never made me feel high either. It took my pain away. But ..I know lots of ppl who to take them for a high. They’re addictive for ppl with an addictive personality. So many ppl have a major problem with it. I always wondered what they’re were talking about or why they were such a big deal but I sometimes think that maybe ppl get a different feeling from them if you really have no kind of symptoms to relieve. Maybe it’s different as opposed to someone like me or someone else who has legitimate pain they are relieving?

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    1. that’s the only logical conclusion I can draw, if you have no pain to relieve, they may get you high, but the problem with that is I don’t even understand what “high” is, and no one can describe it. I’ve heard such descriptions as “it makes you feel good, like nothing can bother you.” Why would you want to go through life living in a fog of happy? I don’t understand it, I’m a practical person. I have pain, I take pain killers. I don’t take them unless my pain is bad enough. If I’m congested, I’ll take an antihistamine or a decongestant. I don’t wake up in the morning and go, you know, I think I’ll take some clariton today, just to see what it will do. People who do don’t make any sense to me. People being cut off their meds is a huge problem that I have to purposely avoid thinking about or I’ll get so angry and frustrated and confused I’m liable to say anything. I don’t know whether the problem is doctors choosing to cut people off, or if they’re being told to cut people off. I always thought doctors were indipendent, they can’t be instructed to do anything so long as they prescribe within reason, but I guess that’s not true anymore than my impression of psychiatric theropy is. I have very negative experiences with doctors, but I don’t go around hating other doctors just because mine happened to be … difficult and unsympothetic. Doctors are people. Some will give people lots of slack, some will cut you off immediately if you’re a difficult patient to treat. That’s not how it should be, but since when has the world ever worked like it should be?

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  5. Honestly, I think the problem here is differentiating between people who are taking kratom or any other drug for legitimate conditions and people who take it to avoid confronting or fixing their own conditions? The line between those two is incredibly vague and open to interpretation. I might think someone is taking a drug, or kratom, for physical or emotional pain, but you might think they’re taking it to avoid confronting those same issues. I hope I’m being clear, I’m not used to being this vague and philosophical. THe medical system is designed for acute treatment of conditions. You come in with pain, they give you pain killers. You come in with depression, they give you antidepressants. Once drugs are prescribed, the doctors tend to point to those and go, “aren’t those working?” If you say no, they may switch meds a bit, but eventually they’ll wash their hands of you if they can’t “figure you out.” No one knows this better than you, you know it far better than I do. I’m not actually on your group, or on the same facebook channels as you are, but from the sound of your anguish, someone is attempting to pidginhole people into the slots they think they fit in, and when they can’t, they condemn them for not fitting.

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    2. I don’t support psychotropics for the majority of mild mental issues. I only support high risk psychotropics if the person is severely sick and it is the last option which will make them somewhat at least functioning .. I had a patient who was catatonic and I’m not so sure Kratom could of helped enough. I think Kratom should be the first thing to try and treat it and then use other meds as a last resort. There are incredibly sick people who are suicidal and maybe they need something stronger at first but then once better could probably be helped with Kratom. But, I think Kratom could be the answer to mental healthcare for generalized anxiety and depression which are both very common in America

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      1. no worries, we weren’t really disagreeing, at least I didn’t think so, we were just trying to navigate a convoluted swamp of the medical industry, and doctors have a lot of influence over that. I absolutely agree with you, kratom first, then other stuff. But we both know what the medical industry thinks of kratom, which doesn’t bother either of us. WHat bothers me is the attitude of the people in those groups. What happens if someone in those groups gets cut off his subs or his methadone? Then he’ll be in withdrawal from those, and that group will label him an addict and dismiss him. At that point, he might learn about kratom and it might help, but his old friends will cut him off for the crime of getting cut off, which is wrong. I’m with you on the other meds too, opioids can be prescribed, but only after trying kratom first. I’ve been saying that for years but what seems to happen is the opposite, opioids, getting cut off, then kratom, and that’s not right either.

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      2. Yep.. and I fully support opioid medication if the patient is being responsible and not abusing them. Heck I actually really feel that a person should have complete free will but I know that’s not reality and a different conversation lol. I mean .. I understand as to why doctors and healthcare professionals have to address a problem if someone is exhibiting dangerous or harmful behavior to themselves but I don’t believe in some of the things they do at these pill/pain clinics like pill counts. There’s no way I would ever go through that. I think it’s absurd and getting too involved in the patient’s personal lives. I think it’s overstepping a boundary. I will never go to a pain clinic. I’m thankful I had a primary care physician who prescribed me medication and now that they’re getting even more stingier I’m thankful I don’t even need to worry about uncontrolled pain thanks to Kratom..

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  6. I actually cringe at myself that I wrote that bc it just shames us more. I will edit that bc what I’m actually trying to say is more that ppl are addicted to wanting to feel better, not trying to get high. Whether taking them for real physical pain or real legitimate mental and emotional pain the reason ppl are taking them and maybe get addicted is bc they’re in pain and are suffering. I think maybe perhaps that’s probably for the majority and maybe a minority simply are trying to achieve some sort of high and think prescription meds are the way to achieve it .. possibly

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    1. Honestly I begin to wonder if this whole opioid chrisis is really as horrible as it’s being made out to be? I don’t mean the overdose deaths, that’s absolutely horrible, but the rest of it? I’m not quite sure what to think, because everything is colored by different people’s opinions. Some think it’s doctors entirely who are the problem, others think it’s entirely street meds, some think it’s a combination, and some don’t have a clue but want all the problematic people to go somewhere far far far away so their idealic lives can’t be troubled by such people. It’s cruel to think like that but a lot of people do. They make no allowances for pain, whether physical or emotional, and I have no idea how that got started. I’m not excluding myself from this, I have my own blind spots and probably think stereotypically too, although I do try to catch myself before I say anything too horrible, but I probably don’t always succeed. With my kratom advocacy, I can sometimes be so focused on kratom that I lose sight of the rest of the world and my focus narrows down to whoever I’m trying to convince or whatever video I’m trying to refute. I do think we need more kratom stories, but the last thing I want to do is browbeat people into giving them, if I did that I’d be little better than the FDA with their nonsense.

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  7. Yeah …there are lots of times I get attacked bc I’m advocating so much so every now and then I rant like this! 😂Btw.. they actually blocked me from the group bc they said I was snippy with the members and I wasn’t allowed to standup or reply to their attacks on Kratom and I basically told them I’m not going to stand for that. They didn’t like that and they’re not interested in the truth regarding their own MAT community. I was wayyy too much truth for them to handle. I don’t miss that group AT ALL.

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    1. oh my god, you actually left the MAT group? I assumed you had either created or were moderating the group, so you couldn’t be banned? Shows what I know. Those people lost one of the staunchest advocates, not just for kratom but for people suffering in general when they were stupid enough to cut you off, and they’ll regret it, assuming they don’t just blunder through life on their methadone and suboxone and dismiss all the people who get cut off their pain meds as casualties. The shortsidedness of these people astounds me. I don’t mind sticking up for you, it’s … just a part of me I can’t seem to escape, I stick up for people. Don’t worry about the occasional rant, when I finally go off the deep end and rant, I can actually cause people to unfollow me or rant back, so what can you do. Can you at least get ahold of people from that MAT group who might be interested in kratom or did they cut you out entirely? Jesus, I can’t think of anything you could say or do that would cause me to cut you off and not allow you to speak in your own defense. Are those MAT people really that blind? Lets break this down to basics. You’re trying to tell them that there’s this herbal option called kratom, which they can try if they want. It might help. You’re not condemning their meds, their rehab centers, or their choices. All you are doing is saying there’s another option. What in god’s name is wrong with that? I can’t understand their problem. You’re not saying kratom is better than what they take, although you do obviously think so or you wouldn’t be taking it, but you’re not shoving it down people’s throats. I’ve never joined that group, but from what you’ve told me it sounds like it’s the other way around, you should take our meds, never mind if you want to, or can afford it, it’s just the way to go, stop trying to disrupt our perfect little world view with your rebel ideas. I’m being a bit sarcastic, but how in the world do people like that get off?

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  9. Yes.. also you are so right. Addiction versus dependence gets confused as being all in one when it’s not. Tons of ppl are dependent on medications. It’s no ones fault bc it is the side effect. But don’t condemn someone for it. It’s not necessarily a bad thing unless adverse side effects start occurring. It doesn’t make sense too that so many ppl all of a sudden think they’re smarter than a PhD and disregard the fact that it’s actually prescribed and legal for patients to take but no reasoning or rational thinking takes place these days. Just opioid hysteria and brainwashing. It’s a very mixed up state of affairs. Why prescribe ppl something and then condemn them for it. That’s messed up. Then for anyone who is dependent they treat it like it’s a mental addiction or substance abuse disorder (for the responsible ones).

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    1. my mom, for instance. Before i switched to kratom, she acted as though I was shooting IV heroine off the streets. It wasn’t much better because it was tramadol from internet pharmacies, but it wasn’t that bad. There was no reasoning with her. She understands pain a bit better because of her chronic pain, but she’s still stubborn and refuses to take pain meds if they’re given to her because she’s deathly afraid of becoming addicted. She seems to equate addiction with terminal diseases like cancer, and there’s no reasoning with her on that either. Man i love commenting, I can go on and on and on and on, but I’m going to try to eventually stop. I don’t know if we can do a live today, but definitely make it a routine, and we can try to bring other people in on it who are interested in trying kratom. Also refute negative articles, videos, and so on. I can type reasonably fast, but I can’t keep up with every negative kratom video, it seems there’s a new one every day, and people, except you, ignore my comments. I think I did get one comment from KELO land that said something to the effect of, kratom doesn’t work, it can’t work, it’s a placeebo effect, if you’re addicted seek help. It was more complex than that but I’m breaking it down

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      1. My mom seems to think of addiction as a willful disease. In other words, I either chose to, or wasn’t strong enough mentally to avoid, becoming addicted, and because she thinks that way, it’s a character flaw in her eyes, so why can’t I just stop and suffer the symptoms, because surely the symptoms can’t be that bad? If you disagree with her, you’ll get something to the effect of, Oh addicts think like that, so of course you’d say that. I hate to find out if that’s the attitude of people in MAT groups? From what you’ve told me, that might be it, or close to it.

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  10. Btw … in reply to therapy and how that works ~ It depends who you see. I advise ppl to go and get therapy from a social worker. Because if you go to a psychologist they want to put you on psychotropics and for the most part I don’t support them. Only for severely mentally insane people I support psychotropics bc they have to have something so they are not literally a danger to society. I’m talking about psychotic murderers, serial killers, certifiably psychotic who NEED to be calmed down so they don’t hurt others or themselves. However, for the general public who experience anxiety and depression that is not involving severe psychosis then I wouldn’t advise going to a psychiatrist or psychologist unless they want to start taking westernized medication. Most social workers don’t have the credentials to prescribe medication. When I saw my therapist/ social worker she said I could if I wanted ..go and see a psychologist and get prescribed medications and I said no thanks. Thankfully, I was a nurse by that time and already had lots of experience in the psych field having lots of knowledge of the horrific and permanent damage those drugs cause. I’ve seen so many patients with Tardive dyskinesia. It’s HEARTBREAKING

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  11. I’m sorry about your mom. It makes me mad and my heart feels your pain. Or it pains MINE bc of the way she must make you feel. She is VERY much in the wrong with her thinking. Probably at least 90 percent (I’m just guessing here) of disease/addiction is inherited. So, lots of times we couldn’t avoid it if we tried. There are different reasons and types of addiction within the brain also. Then it also depends on the person’s brain wiring and personality traits. Like some people do have more addicting traits or personality. I don’t like to say ‘addictive personality’. I hope when ppl realize that maybe they have that that they don’t get hung up on it and let it be shaming. We all have weaknesses and strengths. I was lucky to not be born with that trait and it’s helped me tremendously bc I don’t get severely addicted to anything. <<>> Like .. I had mild problems maybe more like a negative habit of drinking in my 20s but I didn’t let it destroy me. But lots of folks do and it’s a real battle where addiction destroys their life or consumes everything in it. But, it’s so sad to me that if any kind of addiction is declared on ANYONE that in a blink of an eye you’re condemned, shamed, or judged and looked down upon like garbage or less than …or ‘weak’.. This is something I hope I can change or I would like to write about it hoping I can enlighten others to understand. That it’s not the person’s fault, nor is it because they’re ‘bad’ people or whatever it is they seem to think. Who knows maybe your mom has family members who have addiction in the past? It seems like it’s a very touchy subject with her? I wonder if maybe she actually has a severe addictive personality or knows that if she started something even remotely addictive that she’s the type who would become out of control? There has to be something driving her to view so harshly towards anything that can build a tolerance.. But, she WAS the one to tell you about Kratom right so she must support it? Or is she now going back on that 💚 …..It’s been so good talking to you! Great conversation

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  12. She was the one who told me about kratom, and she seems to support it without any harsh comments, at least not obvious ones. He attitude towards nicotine though, is about like her attitude with the tramadol. One of my relatives was in the hospital for something, I’m not sure I know what, and was prescribed tramadol for several bulging discs, and her first reaction wasn’t, well at least the pain will be gone, or i’m glad he’s ok, it was oh great he’ll get hooked on it. I guess I can safely say I’m at least dependent on nicotine, I’ve attempted to quit numerous times, and I always fail. If I’d just waited a week or two to start it, I’d likely never have, I started because wikipedia said nicotine had analgesic, pain killing, effects, and the tramadol wasn’t doing it. Now I can’t easily stop. No horrible withdrawal symptoms like with the tramadol, except a tendency to snap at people and this … very hard to describe it, creeping feeling of uneasiness and nausea that mellisa’s antiemetics don’t deal with. I don’t think I’m addicted, not quite yet, but stopping it is going to be a fight all on it’s own. I don’t smoke, I vape, which is supposed to be slightly safer, but nicotine is nicotine. So she looks down on me because of that, and her attitudes towards addiction resurface whenever I have to resupply, buy more e-liquid, or parts for the machine that uses it. I don’t know precisely what drives her, but I think it’s a combination of texas stubbornness, texas independence, and a dim view of people who aren’t strong enough to simply suffer withdrawal symptoms. I’m not even sure she knows what withdrawal is, and I can’t explain it to her in a way she’d understand. When I was in the midst of tramadol withdrawal I explained the symptoms to her and all I got was, can’t you just take something for those? She couldn’t seem to understand the fact that withdrawal responds only to the type of drug you’re withdrawing from, if it were just a matter of taking something else it wouldn’t be a dependence. Her attitude towards kratom is guardedly positive, which means she’s ready to jump back on me if she thinks I’m becoming addicted to it, or buying more of it than she thinks I need. When I do buy kratom, I usually buy it by the kilo, and if I can afford it, I’ll buy 2 or 3 or even 4 kilos if the sale is good, but I don’t buy kratom every single month, and I have so many capsules that I couldn’t possibly go through them all in a month, which she seems to not like much. I’m not sure what drives me, probably something left over from tramadol pills running out, I have a bit of a hording instinct with kratom. One person without at least a few negative traits is pretty much impossible, but she only comes down on me hard if she senses addiction, or potential addiction, this is vague and not very clear, sorry about that.

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  13. I hope my tweet didn’t agitate you, All I meant by it was that pressing the “like’ button means I have to log in with a word press account, and although I have one, logging in, or specifically, recreating your password means solving a puzzle, called a captia, and although they do have audio challenges, the words are nearly impossible for me to understand, so I don’t use it. I leave these comments to let you know I do read and respond to your posts, I just can’t “like” them without access to my account. But my comments are my likes, if that makes sense. Well, I feel stupid, I can log in with twitter, so I’ll be able to like and like comments now.

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  14. I wish I’d seen this video before, I didn’t even know you’d posted it. Lets get the best out of the way first. You are not, nor have you ever been, a drug addict, drug dependent, nor can anyone who says so comprehend the struggle you deal with every day. My pain is probably not even a drop in the bucket compared to yours, but it feels aweful to me. What are these people giving you as an alternative? Suffer? Take OTC pain meds? Jump through the hoops to get them from a doctor, who by the way, if found out that you used kratom, might then refuse to prescribe them to you, so on days when the kratom is not enough, you’d be forced to suffer. Someone in that much physical agony can’t focus well enough to even get through their ordinary day, let alone drive a car, or perform any task that requires an alert mind. Pain clouds the mind, if it’s severe enough. That doesn’t even begin to describe the mental anguish such pain can cause after a while, you begin to live your life surrounded by not only pain, but a kind of hopelessness, why bother, I’m just going to hurt, so why don’t I just … leaving that unfinished because it doesn’t need finishing. If the MAT people are bringing you down with this then maybe I won’t abstain from knocking off a few heads, or a few dozen. Having been a pain patient myself, compared to relying on a doctor or a pharmacy, not to mention health insurance holding the keys to my pain relief is not something someone should have to go through unless they’ve already tried kratom and it doesn’t work for them. No one has the right to expect you, or anyone to go through that just because that person has some kind of problem with kratom. Skepticism about kratom is completely ok, but once educated, you either have to like it, or leave it. You can’t, or at least shouldn’t take it and continue to advocate for your prior drug of choice. If you don’t want to take kratom, we can’t, and won’t, force you. But you will not bring others down for choosing to do so. This is not a war to see which option, kratom or opioids, is superior. It is an effort to keep kratom available for those who want to take it. Those who choose opioids or recovery centers have every right to choose to do so, but not to both do those and advocate against kratom. When Kami is so disgusted she literally has to make a video to vent, you’ve gone too far. Way too far. It is extremely difficult to get her angry or exasperated enough for that to happen, and yet you MAT people seem to do so on a near weekly basis. I’ve had enough of it! She is choosing to be on a group for you people, trying to help. And she’s repaid with scorn and vitreol? If you persist, I will come there myself, and I won’t be considerate and kind when I do. Kami is one of the nicest people I’ve ever run across in the kratom community, she is volunteering her time to try to help you, and this is what she gets? This is your one and only polite warning. I have deliberately stayed away from her group because she’s completely capable of defending herself on her own, she doesn’t need me. But I will answer the call, if this continues. This is my public promise to do so.

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    2. You are so good to me! Many thanks 😊 It’s a public announcement 🤣in hopes to bring the pain community and addiction community together in a better understanding. I’m probably reaching for the stars but maybe someone will read this and see someone in a different light a positive one. But, I just know how it feels to have to deal with ppl judging simply bc you take an opioid and I don’t agree with that. Even if I’m not on them anymore, I still am a chronic pain patient and I want to represent or at least tell my side bc it’s so common what is happening to pain patients

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    3. Also, my group Southeast Beautiful is a very positive one. We are a great bunch of people and don’t fight. Anytime, you’re interested in joining let me know and I’ll add you. It’s all about Kratom and the latest news regarding politics, advocacy, and the legality of it. 💚

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  15. Hello

    Pada tanggal Min, 1 Nov 2020 06.43, Southeast Beautiful Kratom menulis:

    > Kami Ann Davis posted: ” I’m not condemning anyone. I have been on both > sides of the spectrum so I understand. But, I hope the other side can see > how it feels, as a pain patient. However, I AM condemning the label and > stigma that surrounds the term ‘drug addict’ ~If you like, Pl” >

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  16. I’m interested right now, as a matter of fact. my comment was aimed at the MAt group I thought was heaping on the abuse. Let me see, facebook is complex, I’ll try to find it and join it. Participating will be a bit of a challenge, but I’ll figure it out. How to post to the whole group, don’t mind me, thinking out loud

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    1. I just saw your message! That’s awesome. You have a great picture too. If you are able to create a Facebook account then we could be friends. My group is secret ultra hidden from the public so it’s impossible to find and the only way to join is to be invited.

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      1. I actually have a facebook account, I think I sent you a message with it. Hiding the group makes sense, I was able to find it, but wasn’t able to do much besides send you a message. I didn’t even know I had photo, it’s a blind thing I guess. I’m not sure what my facebook account name is, Kendell Clark I think, there’s no screen name

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  17. Boy did I just stick my foot in my mouth. You were talking about your facebook group, southeastbeautiful, and the whole time I’m imagining this MAT group you moderate, maybe it was the other group that was causing the trouble? Now I’m confused, but either way, I’ll join your southeastbeautiful group, probably stay away from MAT if that’s where the haters are.

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    1. Yes..I left the MAT group or I should say they blocked me from it but it was never my own group. I only moderated there. However, I created a large advocacy group called Southeast Beautiful and I work completely on my own bc I hate drama so I’m the only admin and I have zero moderators. No disrespect to anyone I find it’s just easier to keep track of what goes on in my group that way.

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  18. Sorry I took so long to reply. I sent you a friend request, and a message on facebook and twitter. Two messages on twitter actually, but the last one was the kind of “support” I got when I was on the tramadol and the first couple of months I was on the kratom. Quoted directly from the very unpleasant facebook message sent to me. I’ll try my best to be swift when responding to messages from you and the group, but it might take me a bit, facebook is slow on my internet and it can take me a few minutes to get down to the group messages, I have to scroll through a ton of “you’re an addict’ messages from my relatives, all of them old, before I see new ones.

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